Thursday, October 29, 2009

The universal human right that dare not speak its name?

Last month a document published by the UK's Department for International Development (DFID) said:
"In countries where abortion is legal, DFID will support programmes that make abortion more accessible. In countries where it is illegal...DFID will make the consequences of unsafe abortion more widely understood and will consider supporting processes of legal and policy reform...DFID supports safe abortion on two grounds. First, it is a right...Second, it is necessary."
Except in a part of the United Kingdom, guess which one?

McCann rails here against the hypocrisy of the British government on this, quite right too...but how about the hyprocrisy of the self-styled social progressives of Sinn Fein, the SDLP) and the "pro-British" Unionist parties?

Human and civil rights for all...except the kind of human and civil rights that might upset "our community's" religious applecart?

British rights for British citizens...but we'll cherry pick which British rights we're comfortable with?

7 comments:

tony said...

>>Human and civil rights for all...except the kind of human and civil rights that might upset "our community's" religious applecart?

British rights for British citizens...but we'll cherry pick which British rights we're comfortable with?<<

Agree completely *again*

So where do you stand on Article 8 ECHR infringements in relation to the Orange Orders 'Right to march'?

O'Neill said...

Would I have a problem with peoples' right to (from memory) privacy and security in their own home, nope. It's surprising that it hasn't appeared in more public order cases eg by people living beside football grounds, pubs etc.

But then how can it be reconciled with Article 11 (again from memory) the right to "freedom of assembly" and to, within the law, express a political or religious pov?

Two conflicting "rights' and no corresponding "responsibilties" (other than the fact you've got to keep within the law).

To go back to the reproductive rights question though, it is the state (both the Uk and its make-believe local legislature) and not private individuals or organisations which is denying the rights the Uk govt is saying everybody else in the world is entitled to. It's that contradiction I can't get my head around.

tony said...

>>..in their own home..<<

Article 8 rights are about the person family and home etc. Thus preventing people going about their business, leaving their area/street feeling that they are secure etc. all constitute a breach.

Watched a wierd programme the other night. It was designed to make whites aware of subtle racism, what came across loud and clear was that many do not wish to be aware. On imposing highly offensive anti-Catholic marches where they are not wanted, many Unionists(perhaps like yourself) whilst not supporting them exactly do not seem to see any problems. In effect like the whites on the programme you are part of the problem

>>Two conflicting "rights' and no corresponding "responsibilties" (other than the fact you've got to keep within the law).<<

And yet the law has been very accomodating to OO despite obvious transgretions of the law. Including previous disorder, marching with flags of proscribed organisations, threatening behaviour and partaking of alcohol(outlawed in Scotland) Perhaps Glasgow City Council has the solution in charging the OO the 1.7 million it costs us to police their nearly 300 marches last year(more than in Belfast btw)

>>reproductive rights<<

It is a sub-normal society in the north of Ireland. Whilst I am anti-abortion in principle I understand the realities. However the abortion Act was not intended to be merely the last line of birth control that many now use it as, sadly!

O'Neill said...

Watched a wierd programme the other night. It was designed to make whites aware of subtle racism, what came across loud and clear was that many do not wish to be aware. On imposing highly offensive anti-Catholic marches where they are not wanted, many Unionists(perhaps like yourself) whilst not supporting them exactly do not seem to see any problems. In effect like the whites on the programme you are part of the problem
A case of déjà vu here, I’ve stated my opinion of the OO several times to you on here, a social organisation solely set up to promote the values which lay behind the Reformation I’ve no problem with. I can’t see the point in the marches, contentious (of which Gerry yesterday said there were 6!) or otherwise, or at least no OO member has made me a convincing argument for them

If I’m not a member of the OO (or actually even a Christian, protestant or otherwise) I don’t share any responsibility for their actions simply because I might share the same political belief re the Union as the majority of the OO. Whe you start going down that road of collective communal responsibility you’re walking on very thin ice indeed, eg if a person votes for a party, Sinn Fein, a party which contains members who carried out numerous attrocities AND in some cases show no remorse whatsover forever for carrying out those attrocity does that make that voter also guilty for those attrocities? Only if you believe in the concept of colective communal responsibility.


It is a sub-normal society in the north of Ireland. Whilst I am anti-abortion in principle I understand the realities. However the abortion Act was not intended to be merely the last line of birth control that many now use it as, sadly

Simply saying that women should have the same rights which the Uk govt is preaching through the rest of world doesn’t mean that in every case or circumstance women will or would need to exrecise that right. But thos who are against its provision in the rest of the Uk have made a complete mess at education and providing alternatives- fortunately the catholic church’s opinions on condoms are widely ignored by the faithful or the problem would be even worse. And the reality is that the ban on abortion on the island of Ireland hasn’t stopped Irish women having abortions either backstreet illegal ones or having to cross to England to have them done. Subnormal society or not, that can’t be a moral state of affairs?

tony said...

Oneil

>>Only if you believe in the concept of colective communal responsibility.<<

You are quite right on this, and no it is not my intention. However re-Tory link up with Polish anti-Semites. You are part of a grouping that has always been dominated by the OO. Should the OO be merely a robust Pro-Prod group then whey hey, fill your boots. however they are not.

How do you separate the two?

tony said...

What is moral about having 3 abortions ma man?, honestly! I know such people personally, Like I said the reality is that abortion should be availlable as a last resort not as part of the warped lifestyles of the heartless or lazy. You are the guy who(quite rightly) mentioned rights regarding the OO, and responsibility to use those rights. There are those who abuse the original intentions of the Abortion Act to legally murder(in certain cases, true) their offspring because they can't be arsed to take proper precautions.

Regarding ignoring the Catholic church, I do, but am honest enough to admit my hypocrisy. Going into over-drive on the hypocrisy theme here but the church has the most effective answer of all....................abstention! In 1994 for one reason or another I could not get my Nat King Cole for around 3 months it nearly killed me and the thought of it right now haunts me. I could never abstain but being party to ending the life of my offspring is something that I would only consider*sighs* in very very limited circumstances.

O'Neill said...

Like I said the reality is that abortion should be availlable as a last resort not as part of the warped lifestyles of the heartless or lazy.

But the crucial point is that it should be available- I would have no problem arguing against it as a lifestyle choice.